you need to have -- but it's got to be done under some form of rule or law or moving towards some form of rule of law and an independent judiciary. >> rose: were you surprised about what he said about iraq? >> look, you know, that's an easy -- that's a really easy spit ball to hurl. you left iraq. everyone knows that that was an incredibly long drown out complicated negotiation in which in the end the parties inside iraq failed to come to an agreement on effect asking if united states to stay in iraq and giving the americans the legal cover they needed. i wish we had found a way to keep a residual force there, to bolster to regime there and help them push back on their enemies. but i -- and some might say obama didn't try hard enough. i wasn't privy to the negotiations. i thought they tried hard over months. it was very clear that the iraqis-- because of their own internal politics-- were having a very hard time getting their act together and inviting us to stay which is what they had to do in tend. >> rose: what would he do different than obama on iran? >> well, you know it's hard to